Income Tax Rate History

[Jiddy78]

Check out those marginal rates before Ronnie. Go ahead righties...Give the lefties some hell.

http://www.taxfoundation.org/taxdata/show/151.html

[BoredWithNoSB]

Wow. 70% bracket. I'm about as tax and promote social welfare as they come, but that is just painful. That must have been where some of these economic theories on disincentives to work came from. anything above 50% is just abusive.

[Vegas]

Wow. 70% bracket. I'm about as tax and promote social welfare as they come, but that is just painful. That must have been where some of these economic theories on disincentives to work came from. anything above 50% is just abusive.

50% is way, way too high.

[Jiddy78]

Wow. 70% bracket. I'm about as tax and promote social welfare as they come, but that is just painful. That must have been where some of these economic theories on disincentives to work came from. anything above 50% is just abusive.


Opinions from some of the old-timers would help...but there's reasons why so many of them old coots are righties...Somehow everything got jumbled up into a big pile of religious/atheist, rich/poor pooh....I'm still delving now that this board has me semi-caring about the mannerisms of all these Babylonians around me...

Trying to find a reason...Guessing that I won't like the answer....

[Jiddy78]

50% is way, way too high.

Yup. 40% is as well, yet self-employed middle class pays it.

[Vegas]

Opinions from some of the old-timers would help...but there's reasons why so many of them old coots are righties...Somehow everything got jumbled up into a big pile of religious/atheist, rich/poor pooh....I'm still delving now that this board has me semi-caring about the mannerisms of all these Babylonians around me...

Trying to find a reason...Guessing that I won't like the answer....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laffer_curve

The economy gets choked by high tax rates and the government doesn't collect as much revenue. Besides, the money doesn't belong to the government.

[IBC]

Yup. 40% is as well, yet self-employed middle class pays it.
I thought Bush cut taxes on the middle class? What? He didn't? Oh, I see.

[Vegas]

I thought Bush cut taxes on the middle class? What? He didn't? Oh, I see.

The Bush tax cuts were tiny.

[IBC]

The Bush tax cuts were tiny.

Except to a few Americans.

[Jiddy78]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laffer_curve

The economy gets choked by high tax rates and the government doesn't collect as much revenue. Besides, the money doesn't belong to the government.

Formulas/graphs...Great things...Very informative...But they all start with a starting point...and well, that would seem to me to be a big contention...So, where is that starting point? I think you and I may have differing opinions...thus we're back where we started...So, although I appreciate this information (The second time you've provided it to me)...It hardly answers my questions...It is only a tool.

[pnkpanther]

eye, i'm against high taxes, but not all taxes.

[ryr8828]

Tax the rich, feed the poor, until there are no rich no more...

I'd love to change the world, but I don't know what to do...

So I leave it up to you...

[Vegas]

Tax the rich, feed the poor, until there are no rich no more...

I'd love to change the world, but I don't know what to do...

So I leave it up to you...

We've spent over $11 trillion dollars trying to win the war on poverty yet we still have poor people. Income distribution doesn't work.

[swordfish]

We've spent over $11 trillion dollars trying to win the war on poverty yet we still have poor people. Income distribution doesn't work.

War on Drugs?
War on Terror?
War on Poverty?
War on Communism?

We are all about wars.

None of them have worked.

[Tom Joad]

War on Drugs?
War on Terror?
War on Poverty?
War on Communism?

We are all about wars.

None of them have worked.

It's time to declare a War on Wars.

[Ed Who?]

War on Drugs?
War on Terror?
War on Poverty?
War on Communism?

We are all about wars.

None of them have worked.

That doesn't mean that it's not worth the fight.

I think there should be means for people having financial difficulty to be aided. I just think it's something that should be taken up by churches and other organizations, not the government. Imagine how many people would get real help if each of us was able to personally give back to the community. Instead most of us are so saddled with taxes and the other costs of living life in the 21st Century that the only recourse is to ask Nanny State to take over.

[Tom Joad]

That doesn't mean that it's not worth the fight.

I think there should be means for people having financial difficulty to be aided. I just think it's something that should be taken up by churches and other organizations, not the government. Imagine how many people would get real help if each of us was able to personally give back to the community. Instead most of us are so saddled with taxes and the other costs of living life in the 21st Century that the only recourse is to ask Nanny State to take over.

Magnanimity would run amok! :rolleyes:

[ryr8828]

We've spent over $11 trillion dollars trying to win the war on poverty yet we still have poor people. Income distribution doesn't work.


I know, it was just some song lyrics that jumped into my head.

[KinjaKahn]

It seems odd that when Reagan got in "power" taxes on the wealthy dropped drastically and the national debt skyrocketed.

Ron Paul wants to end futile and utterly silly Wars on... poverty, illitercy, drugs, terror.... as well as empower the idea of Liberty and states rights. He wants a small Federal government just as our founding fathers did. Ron Paul is a constitutionalist. Ron Paul believes in United States of America, not the corporate whore it has become. Ron Paul is a career physician, not a career politician.

[swordfish]

None of the shit works. It is clearly a way to create division and take more of your tax dollars. The federal government has clearly taken over most of the powers granted to the State's. Read the Constitution, any power not declared to the three branches is given directly to the states.
Let us run down our rights and how they are trampled.

Bill of Rights

Amendment I

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.

Can you say Fairness Doctrine? How about when the fed threatened to imprison people for reporting on rights abuses?

Executive Order 10460
Providing for the Performance by the Director of Defense Mobilization of Certain Functions Relating to Telecommunications

Executive Order 10995
Assigning telecommunications management functions

Executive Order 11556
Assigning telecommunications functions

These are ways that the govt can control and take over the media.

Amendment II

A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.

Can you say Gun Control legislation?
Executive Order 10863
Authorizing the Attorney General To Seize Arms and Munitions of War, and Other Articles, Pursuant to Section 1 of Title VI of the Act of June 15, 1917, as Amended

Amendment III

No soldier shall, in time of peace be quartered in any house, without the consent of the owner, nor in time of war, but in a manner to be prescribed by law.
These EO not only can force soldiers in your home, they can take your home, land, and all other property and force you to work in a camp.
Started by JFK in 1962(no wonder he was shot)
Executive Order 10995-11005 assignment of resources to govt agencies including labor workforce.
Executive Order 12656
Assignment of emergency preparedness responsibilities
Section 203:
Resource Management. The head of each Federal department and agency, as appropriate within assigned areas of responsibility, shall:
(1) Develop plans and programs to mobilize personnel (including reservist programs), equipment, facilities, and other resources;
(2) Assess essential emergency requirements and plan for the possible use of alternative resources to meet essential demands during and following national security emergencies;
(3) Prepare plans and procedures to share between and among the responsible agencies resources such as energy, equipment, food, land, materials, minerals, services, supplies, transportation, water, and workforce needed to carry out assigned responsibilities and other essential functions, and cooperate with other agencies in developing programs to ensure availability of such resources in a national security emergency;

Cooperate with other agencies? Like if you resist working they lock you up or execute you? Welfare rolls must be a list of people that can't/won't work, first for termination.

Amendment IV

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

EO 13406 Protecting the Property Rights of the American People
would make you feel safe, but it does not override the emergency based EO described above.

Amendment V

No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a grand jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the militia, when in actual service in time of war or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

see above


Amendment VI

In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the state and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the assistance of counsel for his defense.

Habeus Corpus? The CIA abuses this as they see fit.

Amendment VII

In suits at common law, where the value in controversy shall exceed twenty dollars, the right of trial by jury shall be preserved, and no fact tried by a jury, shall be otherwise reexamined in any court of the United States, than according to the rules of the common law.

Amendment VIII

Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed, nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted.

Excessive fines, give me a break. How can a man that kills another man get less time than a border patrol agent who tries to defend the border(Ramos case) There are too many laws that fail on creating morality. People are incarcerated and become criminals to survive. When they are released they have no where to stay, no job, and they are shunned by the community. Let's create more division.

Amendment IX

The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.

Amendment X

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people.

This one right here is violated every day. From cases about abortion, education, drugs, labor, welfare, and on and on. The States each have the right to have their own laws. This is the United States, not the Federal States.

Wake up folks.

[Tom Joad]

It seems odd that when Reagan got in "power" taxes on the wealthy dropped drastically and the national debt skyrocketed.

Ron Paul wants to end futile and utterly silly Wars on... poverty, illitercy, drugs, terror.... as well as empower the idea of Liberty and states rights. He wants a small Federal government just as our founding fathers did. Ron Paul is a constitutionalist. Ron Paul believes in United States of America, not the corporate whore it has become. Ron Paul is a career physician, not a career politician.

Not all, not Alexander Hamilton or the Federalists.

[swordfish]

Hamilton was a pos. Jefferson tore him up.

[Tom Joad]

Hamilton was a pos. Jefferson tore him up.

Hamilton would've made a better President than Jefferson. As for Jefferson being so great, he did enlarge the power of the FG by purchasing Louisiana from France.

[jcarm22]

A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.

Can you say Gun Control legislation?
Executive Order 10863
Authorizing the Attorney General To Seize Arms and Munitions of War, and Other Articles, Pursuant to Section 1 of Title VI of the Act of June 15, 1917, as Amended
What about the first part of the Second Amendment is infringing on the rights of the states to form a well-regulated militia?

[swordfish]

None of the shit works. It is clearly a way to create division and take more of your tax dollars. The federal government has clearly taken over most of the powers granted to the State's. Read the Constitution, any power not declared to the three branches is given directly to the states.
Let us run down our rights and how they are trampled.

Bill of Rights

Amendment I

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.

Can you say Fairness Doctrine? How about when the fed threatened to imprison people for reporting on rights abuses?

Executive Order 10460
Providing for the Performance by the Director of Defense Mobilization of Certain Functions Relating to Telecommunications

Executive Order 10995
Assigning telecommunications management functions

Executive Order 11556
Assigning telecommunications functions

These are ways that the govt can control and take over the media.

Amendment II

A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.

Can you say Gun Control legislation?
Executive Order 10863
Authorizing the Attorney General To Seize Arms and Munitions of War, and Other Articles, Pursuant to Section 1 of Title VI of the Act of June 15, 1917, as Amended

Amendment III

No soldier shall, in time of peace be quartered in any house, without the consent of the owner, nor in time of war, but in a manner to be prescribed by law.
These EO not only can force soldiers in your home, they can take your home, land, and all other property and force you to work in a camp.
Started by JFK in 1962(no wonder he was shot)
Executive Order 10995-11005 assignment of resources to govt agencies including labor workforce.
Executive Order 12656
Assignment of emergency preparedness responsibilities
Section 203:
Resource Management. The head of each Federal department and agency, as appropriate within assigned areas of responsibility, shall:
(1) Develop plans and programs to mobilize personnel (including reservist programs), equipment, facilities, and other resources;
(2) Assess essential emergency requirements and plan for the possible use of alternative resources to meet essential demands during and following national security emergencies;
(3) Prepare plans and procedures to share between and among the responsible agencies resources such as energy, equipment, food, land, materials, minerals, services, supplies, transportation, water, and workforce needed to carry out assigned responsibilities and other essential functions, and cooperate with other agencies in developing programs to ensure availability of such resources in a national security emergency;

Cooperate with other agencies? Like if you resist working they lock you up or execute you? Welfare rolls must be a list of people that can't/won't work, first for termination.

Amendment IV

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

EO 13406 Protecting the Property Rights of the American People
would make you feel safe, but it does not override the emergency based EO described above.

Amendment V

No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a grand jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the militia, when in actual service in time of war or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

see above


Amendment VI

In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the state and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the assistance of counsel for his defense.

Habeus Corpus? The CIA abuses this as they see fit.

Amendment VII

In suits at common law, where the value in controversy shall exceed twenty dollars, the right of trial by jury shall be preserved, and no fact tried by a jury, shall be otherwise reexamined in any court of the United States, than according to the rules of the common law.

Amendment VIII

Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed, nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted.

Excessive fines, give me a break. How can a man that kills another man get less time than a border patrol agent who tries to defend the border(Ramos case) There are too many laws that fail on creating morality. People are incarcerated and become criminals to survive. When they are released they have no where to stay, no job, and they are shunned by the community. Let's create more division.

Amendment IX

The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.

Amendment X

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the states, are reserved to the states respectively, or to the people.

This one right here is violated every day. From cases about abortion, education, drugs, labor, welfare, and on and on. The States each have the right to have their own laws. This is the United States, not the Federal States.

Wake up folks.

Does anyone care about Section:203 of executive order 12656?

In answer to jcarm22 the bill of rights grants the power. The bastards in power take it away. After the OK fed bombing there were many laws that pretty well make militias obsolete. They have to report troop rosters, weapons and supplies directly to the fed. If they do not comply they are forcibly jailed. How does fed oversight secure militias? In fact it does the opposite. If an enemy was to gain control of our federal government the individual States would soon be taken over since the fed already has knowledge of any resistance. This has nothing to do with conspiracies. The laws are in place to enslave you. Just read the executive orders. These orders are not challenged until an even occurs and the abuse is brought to light. If there is a govt mandated emergency your rights are null and void. By then it is too late, who will defend you?

[hannitykillspuppies]

Does anyone care about Section:203 of executive order 12656?

In answer to jcarm22 the bill of rights grants the power. The bastards in power take it away. After the OK fed bombing there were many laws that pretty well make militias obsolete. They have to report troop rosters, weapons and supplies directly to the fed. If they do not comply they are forcibly jailed. How does fed oversight secure militias? In fact it does the opposite. If an enemy was to gain control of our federal government the individual States would soon be taken over since the fed already has knowledge of any resistance. This has nothing to do with conspiracies. The laws are in place to enslave you. Just read the executive orders. These orders are not challenged until an even occurs and the abuse is brought to light. If there is a govt mandated emergency your rights are null and void. By then it is too late, who will defend you?
the superfriends

[Tom Joad]

Does anyone care about Section:203 of executive order 12656?

In answer to jcarm22 the bill of rights grants the power. The bastards in power take it away. After the OK fed bombing there were many laws that pretty well make militias obsolete. They have to report troop rosters, weapons and supplies directly to the fed. If they do not comply they are forcibly jailed. How does fed oversight secure militias? In fact it does the opposite. If an enemy was to gain control of our federal government the individual States would soon be taken over since the fed already has knowledge of any resistance. This has nothing to do with conspiracies. The laws are in place to enslave you. Just read the executive orders. These orders are not challenged until an even occurs and the abuse is brought to light. If there is a govt mandated emergency your rights are null and void. By then it is too late, who will defend you?

So, are you advocating independent militias or state-organized militias? And, why one over the other?

[ryr8828]

Section 203:
Resource Management. The head of each Federal department and agency, as appropriate within assigned areas of responsibility, shall:
(1) Develop plans and programs to mobilize personnel (including reservist programs), equipment, facilities, and other resources;
(2) Assess essential emergency requirements and plan for the possible use of alternative resources to meet essential demands during and following national security emergencies;
(3) Prepare plans and procedures to share between and among the responsible agencies resources such as energy, equipment, food, land, materials, minerals, services, supplies, transportation, water, and workforce needed to carry out assigned responsibilities and other essential functions, and cooperate with other agencies in developing programs to ensure availability of such resources in a national security emergency;

I view this as interagency cooperation with government personnel and resources. I don't view it as ability to seize private property, or force citizens to work against their will.