Estate "death" Tax

[pnkpanther]

For or against?

and why

[LSU]

For or against?

and why

What is it?

[Vegas]

I'm against it because it's another form of double or triple taxation.

[pnkpanther]

What is it?


taxes paid on your estate when you die

it generally only effects the really wealthy and is usually taxing unrealized capital gains

[Jiddy78]

I like it right where it currently is....Went to a seminar about this...regarding the reversion to the original rules in a couple years....Why not just leave the exemptions at current levels? Seriously, if you can't plan enough to reduce your estate to lower than current exemption levels, you're a sh*t for planning...OR...so damn rich that you can take the hit...

[LSU]

taxes paid on your estate when you die

it generally only effects the really wealthy and is usually taxing unrealized capital gains


OK.

So is that the reason my dad got a big insurance policy taken out on himself? Would that circumvent some of that tax?

[pnkpanther]

lot of myths on death taxes

-Effects everyone

90% of estates pass tax free

-kills family farms

3 of every 10,000 farms have large estate to qualify for an estate tax, and so far, not ONE farm has closed from estate tax (or small business)

-Double Taxation

Again, it's primarly taxing unrealized capital gains.

estate tax effects .14% of the US population

(yet is a very heated issue at times)

[pnkpanther]

OK.

So is that the reason my dad got a big insurance policy taken out on himself? Would that circumvent some of that tax?

is your dads estate worth more then 5 million? i think the current cap

[Jiddy78]

lot of myths on death taxes

-Effects everyone

90% of estates pass tax free

-kills family farms

3 of every 10,000 farms have large estate to qualify for an estate tax, and so far, not ONE farm has closed from estate tax (or small business)

-Double Taxation

Again, it's primarly taxing unrealized capital gains.

estate tax effects .14% of the US population

(yet is a very heated issue at times)


7 million per married/3.5 million per single sounds like a pretty reasonable compromise....Well, at least until a cup of coffee costs that much...

[Jiddy78]

is your dads estate worth more then 5 million? i think the current cap

4 million 2006-2008

7 million 2009 (The one I hope they keep)

[Vegas]

Pnk, why do you suppose Warren Buffet is dead set against repealing the death tax?

[LSU]

is your dads estate worth more then 5 million? i think the current cap



I hope so.

But I really don't know. That last figure I saw was around 1997 or so when I was filling out student loan stuff and needed his info...what he had reported on there was about 1.1 mil...he's been retired since 94, so I don't know how much would be there now...All I know is that he told he the premiums on that policy were 10k a year and he mentioned something about protecting the money with it...just assumed it might have something to do with an estate tax.

[Jiddy78]

Pnk, why do you suppose Warren Buffet is dead set against repealing the death tax?

Nobody else can pay for it and he eats caviar every day anyway...and, you know, has some semblance of a heart....

[Vegas]

Nobody else can pay for it and he eats caviar every day anyway...and, you know, has some semblance of a heart....

It has absolutely nothing to do with his heart. It has everything to do with his wallet.

[Jiddy78]

It has absolutely nothing to do with his heart. It has everything to do with his wallet.

Elaborate, my friend. I am not reading you.

[Vegas]

Elaborate, my friend. I am not reading you.

He runs a highly successful holding company. He buys companies based on prescribed formula. The majority of companies he buys are privately held successful companies that are looking down the barrel of the death tax gun. He essentially buys these places at a deep discount since he offers less than they are worth if it weren't for the death tax. He's lobbying to keep his legislated discounts.

[Jiddy78]

He runs a highly successful holding company. He buys companies based on prescribed formula. The majority of companies he buys are privately held successful companies that are looking down the barrel of the death tax gun. He essentially buys these places at a deep discount since he offers less than they are worth if it weren't for the death tax. He's lobbying to keep his legislated discounts.

Everyone with that kind of wealth used and asshole means to get to that end...Sorry to say it, but I find this to be nearly universal Vegas.

People using vast wealth, and the power that stems from using wealth, to control the avenues in which they continue receiving that revenue stream is no surprise...

But...What is for the common good?

I would argue that a repeal of the estate tax would veer our country in the direction of aristocracy, thus you'd have MORE guys like Warren Buffett tweaking the system....just in different ways...

[Vegas]

Everyone with that kind of wealth used and asshole means to get to that end...Sorry to say it, but I find this to be nearly universal Vegas.

People using vast wealth, and the power that stems from using wealth, to control the avenues in which they continue receiving that revenue stream is no surprise...

But...What is for the common good?

I would argue that a repeal of the estate tax would veer our country in the direction of aristocracy, thus you'd have MORE guys like Warren Buffett tweaking the system....

I disagree. If you allow the people who otherwise sell their company to Buffett to keep their company in the family, you spread the wealth a lot more evenly than passing it to him.

[pnkpanther]

again, we're only talking 3 of every 10,000 business's

[Vegas]

again, we're only talking 3 of every 10,000 business's

I question the accuracy of that number, but let's assume it's correct. Those 3 people are getting screwed hard. Why is that OK?

[Jiddy78]

I disagree. If you allow the people who otherwise sell their company to Buffett to keep their company in the family, you spread the wealth a lot more evenly than passing it to him.


A lifetime of wealth accumulation for Buffett is worth less than a year and a half of estate tax revenues...

Taking that into perspective, how much is Buffett really pulling in on these deals yearly in comparison to what is collected?

A fraction of the money, of course....Hardly that....I'm looking for the bigger dollars in my assumption...Not some a-hole preserving his ability to make wealth...

Heck, a hard core capitalist would probably see Buffett's move as "opportunistic"...So you surprise me...

[Vegas]

A lifetime of wealth accumulation for Buffett is worth less than a year and a half of estate tax revenues...

Taking that into perspective, how much is Buffett really pulling in on these deals yearly in comparison to what is collected?

A fraction of the money, of course....Hardly that....I'm looking for the bigger dollars in my assumption...Not some a-hole preserving his ability to make wealth...

Heck, a hard core capitalist would probably see Buffett's move as "opportunistic"...So you surprise me...

The thing that kills me is that Buffett makes a big deal out of the fact that the estate taxes are the morally correct thing when it's all about his own ability to buy companies at effective discounts of 30-40%. I don't begrudge one's ability to make money legally, but don't go riding your moral high horse around Washington DC lobbying to keep screwing people out of fair market value of their business.

[Jiddy78]

The thing that kills me is that Buffett makes a big deal out of the fact that the estate taxes are the morally correct thing when it's all about his own ability to buy companies at effective discounts of 30-40%. I don't begrudge one's ability to make money legally, but don't go riding your moral high horse around Washington DC lobbying to keep screwing people out of fair market value of their business.


You, me, David Lereah and Warren Buffett in the thunderdome sounds like good fun. Heck, give 'em greenspan too...

[Jiddy78]

You, me, David Lereah and Warren Buffett in the thunderdome sounds like good fun. Heck, give 'em greenspan too...

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