Should we ...

[mosaic]

... be in Haiti? Helping, fixing, damage control .. when we can't even fix NO how many yrs after the fact??

[Jesse Helms' Ghost]

... be in Haiti? Helping, fixing, damage control .. when we can't even fix NO how many yrs after the fact?? Yes, because if we aren't there in Haiti, that country will fall fast into the hands of warlords like what happened in Somalia.

It's a mission of humanitarian efforts but also one that will prevent a country from becoming possible enemy territory.

[mosaic]

Yes, because if we aren't there in Haiti, that country will fall fast into the hands of warlords like what happened in Somalia.

It's a mission of humanitarian efforts but also one that will prevent a country from becoming possible enemy territory.

So something that's been going for what seems like forever now gets put on the backburner so we can assist a country we have no real 'ties' to? I'm not trying to brush over what happened in Haiti. It was a tragedy. But for someone reason I feel ike if we can't help a state in our own country, we're not in a position to help a seperate country.

Call me selfish but this is the way I feel.

[hannitykillspuppies]

Yes, because if we aren't there in Haiti, that country will fall fast into the hands of warlords like what happened in Somalia.

It's a mission of humanitarian efforts but also one that will prevent a country from becoming possible enemy territory.


why is it our job to play world police?

[tichabou]

why is it our job to play world police?

Like it or not, it's a job that we've thrust upon ourselves, especially in the caribbean and latin america. It wouldn't hurt to build up some goodwill in the area either. I'd much rather play world ambulance than world police neways.

[tichabou]

So something that's been going for what seems like forever now gets put on the backburner so we can assist a country we have no real 'ties' to? I'm not trying to brush over what happened in Haiti. It was a tragedy. But for someone reason I feel ike if we can't help a state in our own country, we're not in a position to help a seperate country.

Call me selfish but this is the way I feel.

I think we can help a state in our own country, we just aren't. If it's an issue of isolationism (a position i can respect), thats fine, but if its an issue of I don't think we can, then I just feel like that's incorrect.

[hannitykillspuppies]

Like it or not, it's a job that we've thrust upon ourselves, especially in the caribbean and latin america. It wouldn't hurt to build up some goodwill in the area either. I'd much rather play world ambulance than world police neways.

i don't like it. i don't like it all. i suppose the money, supplies, and non-military aid personnel aren't enough goodwill.

[Vegas]

why is it our job to play world police?

Because we keep electing presidents who want to stick their noses in other countries business.

[LionFanFormerlyInLA]

Like it or not, it's a job that we've thrust upon ourselves, especially in the caribbean and latin america. It wouldn't hurt to build up some goodwill in the area either. I'd much rather play world ambulance than world police neways.

We're expected to help out, but we still get criticized for it. I don't think we'll get any good will out of it sadly.

[Jesse Helms' Ghost]

why is it our job to play world police? Our humanitarian efforts in Haiti mean we're playing 'world police'???

Thank you Hugo friggin' Chavez.

:rolleyes:

[Jesse Helms' Ghost]

So something that's been going for what seems like forever now gets put on the backburner so we can assist a country we have no real 'ties' to? I'm not trying to brush over what happened in Haiti. It was a tragedy. But for someone reason I feel ike if we can't help a state in our own country, we're not in a position to help a seperate country.

Call me selfish but this is the way I feel. To my knowledge, New Orleans has been rebuilt to a large degree.

(Any chance you've noticed that football games are being played their in the same place that once housed hurricane victims??)

What's slowing down the development is the fact that city and State can't do anything on somebody's property if that person isn't there and is now living elsewhere. The gov't can't raze and re-develop the property on its own even if it had the funds to do so.

But as far as the infrastructure/levee/barriers/walls, that's been rebuilt by the Army Corp of Engineers.

[Reagan Smash]

why is it our job to play world police?

Because the world hasn't show the ability to police itself. Maybe that sounds like jingoism, but America for most of it's history went out of it's way not to get involved in World Affairs, and because of that, alot of bad things happened.

[hannitykillspuppies]

Yes, because if we aren't there in Haiti, that country will fall fast into the hands of warlords like what happened in Somalia.

It's a mission of humanitarian efforts but also one that will prevent a country from becoming possible enemy territory.

Our humanitarian efforts in Haiti mean we're playing 'world police'???

Thank you Hugo friggin' Chavez.

:rolleyes:

not just a humanitarian effort. according to you. hugo.

[hannitykillspuppies]

Because the world hasn't show the ability to police itself. Maybe that sounds like jingoism, but America for most of it's history went out of it's way not to get involved in World Affairs, and because of that, alot of bad things happened.

what good things have happened by america getting involved in world affairs?

[BoredWithNoSB]

To my knowledge, New Orleans has been rebuilt to a large degree.

(Any chance you've noticed that football games are being played their in the same place that once housed hurricane victims??)

What's slowing down the development is the fact that city and State can't do anything on somebody's property if that person isn't there and is now living elsewhere. The gov't can't raze and re-develop the property on its own even if it had the funds to do so.

But as far as the infrastructure/levee/barriers/walls, that's been rebuilt by the Army Corp of Engineers.

I'm scared. I agree on all points. I was actually going to post on the football point this morning.

[BoredWithNoSB]

what good things have happened by america getting involved in world affairs?

Did you see the statue of Clinton raised in Kosvo? They seem pretty happy about our involvement. Also, Kuwaitt seems to like us, I think. Liberia kind of loves us too for our help.

when done properly, there are huge benefits.

[TGPackersTwins19]

... be in Haiti? Helping, fixing, damage control .. when we can't even fix NO how many yrs after the fact??

We as in people, yes. We as in government, no.

NO is their own problem now. It has been years.

[Jesse Helms' Ghost]

Because the world hasn't show the ability to police itself. Maybe that sounds like jingoism, but America for most of it's history went out of it's way not to get involved in World Affairs, and because of that, alot of bad things happened. Agreed.

Our isolationism in the beginning of WWII is still one of the things i'm embarrassed about as a Republican and an American.

[TGPackersTwins19]

Agreed.

Our isolationism in the beginning of WWII is still one of the things i'm embarrassed about as a Republican and an American.

If the allies hadn't put so many restrictions on the Germans after WWI, Hitler doesn't rise to power and WWII never would have happened

[Jesse Helms' Ghost]

I'm scared. I agree on all points. I was actually going to post on the football point this morning. (Who are you on the SB?)

I haven't been over there today, yet.

Fixin' to go out for an appt in this showerstorm we're having.

[Jesse Helms' Ghost]

If the allies hadn't put so many restrictions on the Germans after WWI, Hitler doesn't rise to power and WWII never would have happened We should have learned from what we did after the Civil War (Reconstruction).

Agreed.

[Jesse Helms' Ghost]

not just a humanitarian effort. according to you. hugo. This is definitely a humanitarian effort.

I also noted that if we didn't do anything- and just let the country do for themselves- we'd see a backlash down the road.

But, see, i'm thinking about the future, too. You, not so much.

[TGPackersTwins19]

This is definitely a humanitarian effort.

I also noted that if we didn't do anything- and just let the country do for themselves- we'd see a backlash down the road.

But, see, i'm thinking about the future, too. You, not so much.

I think that people, individuals, should group together to support Haiti. I don't see any use in getting the government involved, especially right now when we are so broke it isn't even funny. We don't have the resources available for ourselves, how do we expect to get them to help Haiti?

[BoredWithNoSB]

(Who are you on the SB?)

I haven't been over there today, yet.

Fixin' to go out for an appt in this showerstorm we're having.


rgm.

Just getting to the point in 'new' job where I can balance posting online and doing my work. So, took a bit of a hiatus from posting on both sites.

[tichabou]

I'm scared. I agree on all points. I was actually going to post on the football point this morning.

I too am uneasy with my general agreement.

[hannitykillspuppies]

Yes, because if we aren't there in Haiti, that country will fall fast into the hands of warlords like what happened in Somalia.

It's a mission of humanitarian efforts but also one that will prevent a country from becoming possible enemy territory.

Our humanitarian efforts in Haiti mean we're playing 'world police'???

Thank you Hugo friggin' Chavez.

:rolleyes:

This is definitely a humanitarian effort.

I also noted that if we didn't do anything- and just let the country do for themselves- we'd see a backlash down the road.

But, see, i'm thinking about the future, too. You, not so much.


where do you say anything about us receiving backlash down the road for doing nothing?

i'm thinking about the future of a country i actually live in. you, not so much.

[BoredWithNoSB]

i'm thinking about the future of a country i actually live in. you, not so much.

Actually he is. Having bad, unstable states within a raft ride of your borders is not good for us, especially if those that don't like us get smart lend support where we do not. Saw some Iranian soldiers out there in the UN peace keeping force, for instance. I wouldn't like for them to have an outpost any closer to us than they already do.

[hannitykillspuppies]

Actually he is. Having bad, unstable states within a raft ride of your borders is not good for us, especially if those that don't like us get smart lend support where we do not. Saw some Iranian soldiers out there in the UN peace keeping force, for instance. I wouldn't like for them to have an outpost any closer to us than they already do.

paranoia is a powerful thing.

[BoredWithNoSB]

paranoia is a powerful thing.

Meh, I see this as three-fold benefit. Saving lives (which is always the right thing to do, regardless of cost), national security as mentioned, and good PR for us (which helps in national security too).

I think this 500M is much better spent than most 500M we've spent in Iraq, for instance.

[hannitykillspuppies]

Meh, I see this as three-fold benefit. Saving lives (which is always the right thing to do, regardless of cost), national security as mentioned, and good PR for us (which helps in national security too).

I think this 500M is much better spent than most 500M we've spent in Iraq, for instance.it's 500m we don't have.

[Vegas]

it's 500m we don't have.

And we get to pay it back with interest. With all of the foreign held debt we have, wouldn't you think that some of those foreign governments could contribute some money to the cause in Haiti instead of just loaning it to us?

[tichabou]

paranoia is a powerful thing.

Not sure it's paranoia. We already have one anarchic neighbor (mexico), and iirc, it's causing us some problems.

[hannitykillspuppies]

And we get to pay it back with interest. With all of the foreign held debt we have, wouldn't you think that some of those foreign governments could contribute some money to the cause in Haiti instead of just loaning it to us?

that interest is a small price to pay to make sure iran doesn't setup shop there.

[Reagan Smash]

it's 500m we don't have.


Do you pay 500m now, or god knows how much later. Yes, it does suck that we're the world police, but hell, this is Haiti, going back to the Monroe Doctrine the interest of this country would have concerned America. Besides humanitarian needs, you can't have a country that close to you just totally destabilize because it almost always costs you in the end.

[Vegas]

Do you pay 500m now, or god knows how much later. Yes, it does suck that we're the world police, but hell, this is Haiti, going back to the Monroe Doctrine the interest of this country would have concerned America. Besides humanitarian needs, you can't have a country that close to you just totally destabilize because it almost always costs you in the end.

The US government spends $500 million taxpayer dollars we don't have in Haiti and private charities spend millions of dollars in Haiti. Which is more efficient?

Americares pays out over 99% of donations in actual relief. The Salvation Army has paid out over 98% of donations in actual relief for over 150 years. Private charities are far better at helping than the government is.

[Reagan Smash]

The US government spends $500 million taxpayer dollars we don't have in Haiti and private charities spend millions of dollars in Haiti. Which is more efficient?

Americares pays out over 99% of donations in actual relief. The Salvation Army has paid out over 98% of donations in actual relief for over 150 years. Private charities are far better at helping than the government is.

Then have the government give the money to private charities then. With the way this government wastes money, 500 million to Haiti isn't going to cause me to lose sleep. I'm sorry to say that, and I know it makes me sound like I don't care, but I'm not going to bitch and moan about money given to a place that needs it while pork products and government waste it the real cause of the "tax problem".

[Vegas]

Then have the government give the money to private charities then. With the way this government wastes money, 500 million to Haiti isn't going to cause me to lose sleep. I'm sorry to say that, and I know it makes me sound like I don't care, but I'm not going to bitch and moan about money given to a place that needs it while pork products and government waste it the real cause of the "tax problem".

Voters send politicians to Washington and are OK with having those pols raise their taxes for such causes. The money comes from taxpayers. There are plenty of delusional people who think that there's some magic money from Washington DC. I've said for years that for a huge percentage of federal expenditures, the government and the people would be far better off if the feds provided a free post office box to private charities where people could send funds for things like disaster relief in Haiti.

[Jesse Helms' Ghost]

where do you say anything about us receiving backlash down the road for doing nothing? You didn't. I did.

But as usual, ideas, thoughts, and concepts find their way over your head.

[Jesse Helms' Ghost]

I'm scared. I agree on all points. I was actually going to post on the football point this morning.I too am uneasy with my general agreement. Looks like we're gonna have a lotta folks on the left washing themselves clean tonight.

:D

[Jesse Helms' Ghost]

The US government spends $500 million taxpayer dollars we don't have in Haiti and private charities spend millions of dollars in Haiti. Which is more efficient?

Americares pays out over 99% of donations in actual relief. The Salvation Army has paid out over 98% of donations in actual relief for over 150 years. Private charities are far better at helping than the government is. Problem is when we're handing out the aid.

Didja see the mobs of people fighting over the MRE's and water???

We do need the military's involvement at this point....the place is a large riot zone.

[hannitykillspuppies]

You didn't. I did.

But as usual, ideas, thoughts, and concepts find their way over your head.which is why i asked where you said anything about it. you didn't.

[hannitykillspuppies]

Problem is when we're handing out the aid.

Didja see the mobs of people fighting over the MRE's and water???

We do need the military's involvement at this point....the place is a large riot zone.we're the only country with a military.

[Jesse Helms' Ghost]

we're the only country with a military. Obviously France doesn't have one (and wasn't using their planes to transport the supplies that that French idiot got all pissy about with our air control crew).

:rolleyes:

[hannitykillspuppies]

Obviously France doesn't have one (and wasn't using their planes to transport the supplies that that French idiot got all pissy about with our air control crew).

:rolleyes:
great so we can leave and let them handle it since they seem to think they can do it more efficiently.

[Jesse Helms' Ghost]

great so we can leave and let them handle it since they seem to think they can do it more efficiently. The comedy never ceases.

It's NBC's new Tonight Show host....HKP!!

:rolleyes:

[TGPackersTwins19]

The US government spends $500 million taxpayer dollars we don't have in Haiti and private charities spend millions of dollars in Haiti. Which is more efficient?

Americares pays out over 99% of donations in actual relief. The Salvation Army has paid out over 98% of donations in actual relief for over 150 years. Private charities are far better at helping than the government is.

Exactly. Charities are much better equipped for this kind of thing.

[hannitykillspuppies]

The comedy never ceases.

It's NBC's new Tonight Show host....HKP!!

:rolleyes:

the comedy is you claiming that there is no policing effort being made by the military. and then saying we need the military there because we don't want haiti falling into the wrong hands and because haiti is a riot zone.

[Jesse Helms' Ghost]

the comedy is you claiming that there is no policing effort being made by the military. and then saying we need the military there because we don't want haiti falling into the wrong hands and because haiti is a riot zone. Learn the difference between a 'police action' and a 'humanitarian effort'.

To my knowledge, the 'military' that's being used isn't bombing Korea, Nam (or Laos or Cambodia, for that matter) or trying to capture Noriega. They are there in a humanitarian nature.

But given that you think we're there in an 'occupying' fashion, Hugo, your ignorance will probably continue on this.

[hannitykillspuppies]

Learn the difference between a 'police action' and a 'humanitarian effort'.

To my knowledge, the 'military' that's being used isn't bombing Korea, Nam (or Laos or Cambodia, for that matter) or trying to capture Noriega. They are there in a humanitarian nature.

But given that you think we're there in an 'occupying' fashion, Hugo, your ignorance will probably continue on this.

i never once said we were occupying anything.

you continue to contradict yourself.

[Jesse Helms' Ghost]

i never once said we were occupying anything. Pretty much hinted at it with your 'police action' and 'paranoia' BS.

why is it our job to play world police?paranoia is a powerful thing.we're the only country with a military.
BTW, we aren't the only country with a military there.
:rolleyes:

[hannitykillspuppies]

Pretty much hinted at it with your 'police action' and 'paranoia' BS.


BTW, we aren't the only country with a military there.
:rolleyes:you literally can't comprehend anything you read. seriously. it's not even a joke anymore. do me a favor and don't read my posts. trying to convey simple thoughts and ideas to you is like trying to squeeze blood from a stone.

and btw, great, that means we don't need ours there.

and the paranoia comment was in response to someone seeing two iran un troops on the news and worrying that if we aren't there than haiti might fall into iran's hands. please explain how that is me hinting that we are occupying haiti?

[Jesse Helms' Ghost]

you literally can't comprehend anything you read. seriously. it's not even a joke anymore. do me a favor and don't read my posts. trying to convey simple thoughts and ideas to you is like trying to squeeze blood from a stone.

and btw, great, that means we don't need ours there.

and the paranoia comment was in response to someone seeing two iran un troops on the news and worrying that if we aren't there than haiti might fall into iran's hands. please explain how that is me hinting that we are occupying haiti? Problem- for you- is that i can comprehend what's been posted and 'get' that you like playing these stupid little shell games with what you said and what you want others to think after you try requalifying yourself.

:rolleyes:

[KinjaKahn]

We as in people, yes. We as in government, no.

NO is their own problem now. It has been years.
Brilliant! Seriously :) Govt. is not your daddy or free insurance company.

[Jesse Helms' Ghost]

Let's make sure, folks, that we're not accusing Haitians of being similar to welfare slackers or illegal aliens.

Haiti didn't come here illegally and put its hand out for free grub and donations. It suffered a pretty hard-hitting earthquake.

One might've forgotten that even when we had our own Hurricane Katrina, Mexico supplied truckloads of help (yup) and water and to the folks in N.O.

Being the closest, and largest, nation to Haiti it is our duty to help those who can't help themselves. And we should be doing it as both a nation and as individuals.


Oh btw, this from a source many here fawn over.....
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_response_to_Hurricane_Katrina

Ya, even we didn't do it all by ourselves.

[hannitykillspuppies]

Problem- for you- is that i can comprehend what's been posted and 'get' that you like playing these stupid little shell games with what you said and what you want others to think after you try requalifying yourself.

:rolleyes:


shell games? i don't requalify anything i say. you on the other hand...

[hannitykillspuppies]

Let's make sure, folks, that we're not accusing Haitians of being similar to welfare slackers or illegal aliens.

Haiti didn't come here illegally and put its hand out for free grub and donations. It suffered a pretty hard-hitting earthquake.
One might've forgotten that even when we had our own Hurricane Katrina, Mexico supplied truckloads of help (yup) and water and to the folks in N.O.

Being the closest, and largest, nation to Haiti it is our duty to help those who can't help themselves. And we should be doing it as both a nation and as individuals.

Oh btw, this from a source many here fawn over.....
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_response_to_Hurricane_Katrina

Ya, even we didn't do it all by ourselves.


they are here now and they are taking free money. but it's ok, they're signing promisary notes. those are as good as cash sir. see that one, it's for a lamborghini, might want to hold on to that one.

we are not the closest nation to haiti.

[ryr8828]

Aide to Haiti kind of reminds me when I took a care package of diapers, home canned vegetables, and formula to a friend of mine and his girlfriend who had just had a baby and had no work.

She said "You didn't bring any beer?"

[Jesse Helms' Ghost]

we are not the closest nation to haiti.
Sorry, i forgot to add *Developed*.

None of the other nations nearby have the wherewithall we have to help the Haitians.

[Jesse Helms' Ghost]

shell games? i don't requalify anything i say. you on the other hand... Of course you don't.

:rolleyes:

[hannitykillspuppies]

Of course you don't.

:rolleyes:
i don't.

[mosaic]

i don't.

This is the note this thread ended on? For shame!

[hannitykillspuppies]

This is the note this thread ended on? For shame!
you're welcome.

[KinjaKahn]

This is the note this thread ended on? For shame!
Did for some reason you think the poll/thread you made has some sort of special status and should still be going strong a a month and a half later?

[Jesse Helms' Ghost]

Did for some reason you think the poll/thread you made has some sort of special status and should still be going strong a a month and a half later? ...and given that there aren't all that many folks over here to begin with.

[mosaic]

Did for some reason you think the poll/thread you made has some sort of special status and should still be going strong a a month and a half later?

No but I didn't think that was the note on which it was going to end on.

[FatDumbOxycontinAbuser]

Let's make sure, folks, that we're not accusing Haitians of being similar to welfare slackers or illegal aliens.

Haiti didn't come here illegally and put its hand out for free grub and donations. It suffered a pretty hard-hitting earthquake.

One might've forgotten that even when we had our own Hurricane Katrina, Mexico supplied truckloads of help (yup) and water and to the folks in N.O.

Being the closest, and largest, nation to Haiti it is our duty to help those who can't help themselves. And we should be doing it as both a nation and as individuals.


Oh btw, this from a source many here fawn over.....
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/International_response_to_Hurricane_Katrina

Ya, even we didn't do it all by ourselves.

Admittedly I'm six Newcastles deep but I think I agree with JHG??:confused:

[mosaic]

Admittedly I'm six Newcastles deep but I think I agree with JHG??:confused:

That can't be good for business.

[JimmytheHarp]

well We created the damn place, and have been pitting one dominican dictator over another and against the duvaliers since the 50's, playing both sides whenever one looked like he was leaning a little left so we might as well be in there now.

[mosaic]

Learn the difference between a 'police action' and a 'humanitarian effort'.

Whats the difference? I think that lines been blurred plenty.